I just watched Reasonable Dont on this case. Lieutenant Christopher Coble and Sergeant Suzanne Pearson would later testify that Patricia cried and apologized to 18-month-old Nicole, telling the baby, Im sorry for doing this to you and lamenting to the officers that she would never see little Nicole again. I think Patricias defenders are implying the hair came from some unknown person. Prosecution leader McIntyre, when interviewed, laughingly dismissed him as a nut in an effort to trivialise Traupmans input. 5 years prior to all this happening! PS Speculative lies is meaningless. The police considered the possibility that Joann ran away, a theory disputed by her family. The fact that previous boyfriends noted her obsession with Andrew is very, very telling. 18+ When 21-year old Jessie Morrison is brutally beaten to death, police zero in on Vonda Smith. Narcissistic and violent tendencies are very common. The authorities charged her with two counts of murder. Keep her murdering ass locked up!!! They are total bs. Wrong Man Season 2 Review: Joe Berlinger's Dream Team Tries Changing Were suppose to ignore the actual forensic evidence and forensic opinions because we were told that a cop overheard her claiming she confessed? And when Patricia was taken into custody where they removed 39 hairs with root, and then all of a sudden after the FBI report say that the hair tested had NO ROOT ATTACHED, the hair tested had a root? The FBI even included a written report to that effect. Sorry ladiesher hair was in the car and at the scene.she murdered them. A correction to the comment above. It was winter which are cold in PA and would slow down decomposition and minimize insect activity although you are correct about the rodentswhy were there none? The person who killed Joann is currently serving a life sentence because 10 months after Joann and Alex died, he killed another woman (who bore a striking resemblance to Joann) and her baby. The couple moved into Andrews sturdy brick house at 740 Front Street in Catasauqua, Pennsylvania. You, however, consider your ill-informed opinion superior to them not only that, you then go to great lengths to belittle them. Hoist by my own petard! I hope she rots in hell. The Worldwide Womens Criminal Justice Networks website also points to a bombshell: In 2015, the Justice Department acknowledged that most of the team members from an FBI microscopic hair comparison unit gave prosecutors flawed data from 1980 to 2000 that could have unjustly contributed to a number convictions including Patricia Rorrers. Andrew had an ex-girlfriend, Patricia Rorrer, who'd been familiar with the trail, and she'd previously managed a horse stable just a mile from the scene. I certainly dont consider its more likely the victims husbands the perp than Rorrer, as has been suggested, leaving Rorrer or a stranger. I agree that the putative motive is relatively weak (though motive is ultimately subjective and theres no accounting for anger, bitterness, jealousy etc) and to convict on that substantially would be absurd. In April 1995, the family buried Joann and Alex in a single bronze casket after a funeral mass at a Bethlehem church. However, my curiosity is piqued as to why Andrews mother didnt report the missing daughter in law, Joanne and her own grandson Alex! DA readily agreed they did not belong to Rorrer, was happy to admit they were never submitted for analysis. SHE IS NOT GUILTY OF THESE CRIMES. She didnt kill those two boys and TX knows, but they made too much noise about it, hence this is probably the real reason that Darlie hasnt been put to death 24-25 yrs later. At 17, Patricia dropped out of high school and married landscaper Gary Gabard. They retested the hair for DNA evidence with updated technology definitely Patricias hair case closed. Why risk an appalling crime just to leave a marriage (though I know that people have and do kill the spouse in these situations, but killing ones children is extremely rare, particularly when not in murder-suicide context). The fact that there is LITERALLY NO EVIDENCE that Patricia was actually obsessed with Andy; they spoke as friends maybe twice a year. Then 31 years old, she had lived a rocky existence. Also why if beaten with a gun or with whatever, why was there no blood on the clothing? And NOBODY saw her at all? You seem to have a fragile ego. WATCH: ID Examines 1994 Lehigh Valley Double-Murder - People This woman was not innocent, but she is very good at manipulating people into feeling sorry for her. But defense lawyer Robert Pfeiffer said that plenty of evidence supported Patricias innocence. Thats my life.. They noted houses near the murder scene would have heard a gunshot in December, when no farm equipment is making noise, and question why the murderer didnt just kill Joann inside her house instead of risking being seen in public in her car. ALL IT THEN BECOMES IS A SOURCE OF INACCURACIES AND SPECULATION, WHICH ONLY SERVES TO BOLSTER THOSE WITH THAT MENTALITY AND PERPETUATE THE LACK OF TRUTH. That poor child who grew up with no mom for absolutely no reason. (We didnt get into the specifics.). Just one example. Theyre more than happy to exaggerate and speculate the details of the crime, which serves to attract more viewers who (like you) seem to be happy to believe it all. Even if there were some minor flaws or discrepancies in the investigation, thats normal. If you want to help her tell her to ask God for forgiveness. The Free Patricia Rorrer page responds to comments from supporters (How is this even possible that this woman is still in jail?!? But Im sure that was just a coincidence LOL. They had a son, Alex Martin, in August of 1994. The Common Sense Guy you should put yourself on top of the list of deluded people. For more on the Katrinak murder case, you can watch Autopsy Six: A Fatal Attraction for free on YouTube. Phone records confirmed Patricia placed the earlier call from North Carolina, not Pennsylvania. Sure theres DNA, but if she truly is innocent then why not advocate to find the gun. She didnt need to have owned all the guns she ever used, nor to have owned the gun she in fact used. False. And your contention that you (me) as ONE person are wrong, let me say that while you seem to be determined in singling me out as someone whos opinion is one against the rest, is hopelessly exaggerated. Police identified the pair as Joann and Alex Katrinak. That documentary points out that, despite the bodies of the two victims supposedly being exposed for several months, their condition remained relatively undisturbed by weather or animal activity. I dont even know its Christmas.. State police and the Philadelphia division of the FBI appealed to the public for leads. Discuss and express opinion; stop short of asserting that those of the other view (that of judge and jury, at least) are ignorant of facts and wrong, and youre right, because by definition its reasonable for lay people to accept the jury verdict. If you have ever met or been in a relationship with a narcissist, the former partner being with a more young and attractive-looking person would make them go off. She wanted all men to give her attention but she couldnt have everyones attention, especially ANDREWS!!! Unless theres a complicity between him and her, and the reason she didnt divulge it is because she hopes to put all the blame on him, when she was the one to murder and he was a planner. But I agree with a recent comment.. Why not do a paternity case so just that is done and out of the way. This woman killed and is where she belongs! What the prosecution failed to disclose to Rorrers defence team was that the cops, in their zeal to prove their gun theory, visited several addresses of which Rorrer was resident, dug up the gardens in which she was known to do target practice recovered several shell casings and bullets (more than 70), had them ballistically tested, but NOT ONE was found to be a match to the bullet recovered from the victim. After an hour Id call anyone whod listen to me including police! Another inaccuracy in this is, they state the jury took SIX HOURS to return a verdict, when in fact it took less than TWO HOURS. Patricia made daily phone calls every day but made no calls at all the day before, of and after Joannes murder as she was traveling and knew her phone could track her location. I THINK THEY SHOULD REOPEN THIS CASE AND LOOK AT THE HUSBAND JUST SAYING BUT IN MY HEART AND MIND FROM READING ALL THE NOTES AND STUFF PATRICA IS NOT GUILTY AND THEY NEED TO SET HER FREE. February 8, 2020. Meanwhile, the case of the missing mother and baby turned into colossal news across the U.S. and internationally. And because some of Patricias advocates have suggested Andrew Katrinak had a motive for murder, I checked into whether he had a life insurance payout to gain upon Joanns demise. Your pathetic attempt to insult not only shows a not very original comment, but clearly displays a lack of intelligence. OK my GUESS is Patricia did do it! Counsel for Patricia Rorrer, 52, argued in Lehigh County Court that investigators mishandled DNA evidence, WFMZ-TV 69 reports. There is a term in law called balance of probabilities, which basically means that guilt is assigned when there is a preponderance of evidence that would lead a rational person to conclude that the person did it. One lengthy sentence which goes on and on and concludes with one of my sentences from a previous comment! (Nope. This time, not surprisingly, the FBI did achieve a match. It seems so, according to you. Theres something very important to this case that needs to be mentioned more than anything else THE GUN. And dance instructor William Jarrett couldnt remember whether she attended his dance class at the club the night of Joanns disappearance. There was a blood-stained fingernail and hair found on the victims body, and even though (in Keith Morrisons Dateline documentary) the Asst. LONGTIME SUSPECT CHARGED IN MURDERS\ - Greensboro News and Record Then 31 years old, she had lived a rocky existence. Exactly Shame on your for defending a vicious killer. Joann and Alex Katrinak: Still No Justice (Update) They were there in the winter months in which the bodies would have been frozen most of the time. Im a hunter and in the spring I have found many dead deer that died from starvation or other reasons and the bodies are untouched. She made an effort to look perfectly groomed even when she took out the trash, according to her mother, who appeared on Forensic Files. Conflicting versions. Superior Court states that Patricia Rorrer and Andy Katrinak's romantic relationship ended in May, 1993 only one year before the murders. And the obvious answer is not as you claim. It wasnt aimed at any one video producer. In addition to the Facebook page, there are Reddit threads on her case. Which explains why she made Joann kill the baby, or suffer from the environmental elements. So, if you feel you have to be critical of me, you should also bear in mind those hate-mongers and perhaps have a word with them too. I dont think she was ever scared until we put the cuffs on her.. As I stated previously, if she cannot speak for herself, Im happy to step up on her behalf. Those that think that Patricia is innocent are simply groping at straws. February 29, 2020. WoW! And this was never disclosed to Rorrers Defence. I was so excited that I called everyone, and Joanne picked up the phone and she said Andy is married, and I said I know, then she said we have a baby, and I said yea I know, then she said dont ever call here again. Its definitely getting rougher every day, Andrew told the Morning Call. Beautifully said Cliff! Out of the two hairs found in the car only one had enough root to perform a DNA match which did match but police waited to arrest Patricia until a highly advanced and accurate match could be made, which took a year. If the answer is no, enough said! Rest in peace Joann and Alex. Rorrer killed these two people in cold blood and the jury got it right! As for an epilogue on ex-flame Andrew Katrinak, he has moved to Colorado and kept a low profile since the trial ended. What did the ME report as to the age of the baby? Joanns gun and beating wounds were obvious, but the baby died a less violent (but just as horrible) death with no clear signs. Im trying to understand exactly your reasoning asking me staying away from this site because of my insulting remarks! Go somewhere else where your asserted expertise will be professionally tested and you wont be so frustrated and insulting about those who disagree (with your expertise and opinion). You are absolutely right. Patricia Rorrer has been portrayed as a bully, petty thief, neglectful horse owner, and heartless killer or a sweet, caring friend railroaded by authorities desperate to solve a double-murder case that snagged worldwide interest. Tragedy also touched Patricias life. This is all BS.She did it. Joann was fun, likable, beautiful, always happy, said her sister-in-law Cindy Wiard. Presumably if they thought the evidence was against the states case, thats how theyd present as theres no obvious reason for them to be biased one way or the other. Wrong Man Season 2 Release Date Confirmed (Exclusive) Most damning of all the evidence is the hair which was DNA matched to Rorrer which was instrumental in her conviction. There are judges, eminent lawyers and writers who are in support of her. If Rorrer is innocent, she is a victim of a terrible miscarriage (terrible relatively because she is regarded as a child-killer and has been incarcerated for a many years) which I hope is corrected as soon as possible. Its a video on Utube Judges For Justice featuring her case. Keep up your delusions. It's been more than 20 years since Patricia Rorrer was convicted of killing her ex-boyfriend's wife, Joann. Not normal folks obsessed ones do. The investigation is a bit out of place, but the DNA test can be altered only if its made just from a pen, because otherwise it is not possible, only if they said they did it and didnt actually do it, which would be quite difficult because it would mean complicity between many persons. Patricia Rorrer was convicted in 1998 of murdering a young mother named Joann Katrinak as well as her 15-week old infant son. To prove it 110% rather than just 99% I dont know why they wouldnt retest the hair fibers etc. And about the only thing from your comment with which I can agree, is you saying thats not proof theyre right in reference to their verdict. no blood, no finger-prints and no soil evidence it was as if the car had been wiped clean stated the attending investigating police officer!That itself has to be considered highly suspicious and cast doubt on the hair evidence which WAS found. This case is not over yet more to follow only trouble is, law moves along at a pitiful pace. There is no justice for your loved ones when the wrong person is paying for the crime. Some two years into the investigation of Rorrer, a court order was obtained to remove hair specimens from her. Book her. The real killer is Rorrer! It was Patricias hair no question. They depict scenes which are pure speculation or exaggeration or present scenes, which in fact were only theories mentioned at her trial. And I can back up that claim by the fact I have read, watched and listened to all there is to know about this case. 1994 double-murder case returns to Lehigh County Court - lehighvalleylive Rorrers filed multiple appeals over issues you raise, the latest recently and rejected. Are you even aware there are judges, eminent writers, lawyers and TV personalities and countless other ordinary people all of whom steadfastly support her as being innocent and wrongly convicted. These are brutal, aggressive crimes in their own right, but that. Ive found that in nearly every case, those who are firmly of the opinion shes guilty have an extremely limited knowledge of the case theyve watched one (or perhaps more) of the documentaries which make absolutely no attempt to show anything thats in Rorrers favour (theres plenty, if one bothers to look), and worse, revel in exaggerated and speculative scenes, some of which were never even mentioned at her trial. The longer it took to find the bodies the easier it would be for her alibis to be believed as it wouldve been harder for people to remember if she was at a dance class etc that she regularly attended on that specific date. So we can just pretend that everyone is honest all of the time? What evidence is there she actually left the state? Why bother with this site, which isnt for professional criminalists/forensic scientists, if youre going to get so tetchy and rude? Were I a prosecutor I would consider the aforementioned characterisation technically false and failing in probity. Although the prosecution used it as evidence that she was trying to create a false alibi, it actually sounded more like Patricia was simply trying to nail down the facts he had already asserted to her. I hope and pray the cops and the husband will finally do the right thing. 51min. Update/Clean-Up. But it doesnt make a nonsense of her being the shooter, regardless of their speculation. I hope she suffers and goes insane from loneliness. which makes a complete nonsense of their gun theory. Patricia Rorrer will burn in hell, as she should. Why would it be an irony for a person to express his opinion? Not everything is a conspiracy. Puny policy. Startling new allegations surround one of Lehigh County's most notorious murder cases. Which, for this very reason, is at present being investigated by a federal judge? My husband passed away of a broken heart, Sarah OConnor said on the Montel Williams Show in 2001. I would very much be interested in any comment you can offer in response to my input here. They depict scenes which are pure speculation or exaggeration or present scenes, which in fact were only theories mentioned at her trial. At 6 a.m. on June 24, 1997, police arrested Patricia at her modest house in Linwood, North Carolina, and took her back to Pennsylvania. Your email address will not be published. I do not think Mr K is guilty. Every type of cut, bruise etc would heal perfectly in that time. DNA testing revealed the blood came from either Joann or her son. Its not logical to say we know the truth unless we seen it for ourselves. No way for 4 months, that deceased baby would still be resting across the mothers chest. Patricias accusers theorized that she resented Joanns domestic bliss with the tall, athletic Andrew Katrinak. Rorrer and Katrinak broke up in 1989 five years before the murders and Andy married Joann in May, 1993 after dating for approximately one year. Why is this even a question, why people are trying to take out killers into society? Unfortunately for Joanne this psycho took it badly. Highly charged case. More than 20 years after her conviction, Patricia Rorrer still has advocates working to exonerate her. If that really is the case, the husbands alibi for a date months before becomes irrelevant. From what Ive seen its pretty obvious Patricia did do that to this poor woman and the baby. Police couldnt determine whether the baby died of exposure or suffocation. Patricia Rorrer Brutal Killing of Joanne Katrinak & Baby - FFF I dont think so. I really never thought of it again.. The state made a case fueled by circumstantial evidence and public outrage over the deaths of a modern-day madonna and child. I was like OK, maybe she was tired, you know with a new baby. Another former boyfriend said she talked about Andrew frequently and liked to gaze at old photos of him. His defenders claimed that the confession was coerced, the video was grainy/unclear or doctored and the witness was confused and/or unreliable. It is of course good and desirable that third parties press the case for innocence because it maximises the chance that guilty verdicts are correct (given that it is worse for the innocent to be found guilty than the reverse). Well, at least you managed some sense there when you say that, especially when you take into account the amount of evidence and witnesses which were withheld from the Defence and what appears to be a clear case of evidence-tampering. How about the mix up with the hair and the fact that it was not forensically tested (outside of the one man who compared the hairs through naked eye). And I have absolutely no sympathy. Those bodies would have been manipulated by something around there. I believe in Patricias innocence and she deserves to be freed, at last! Her mother was married to my uncle. Strands of the accuseds dyed-blond hair at two crime scenes proved it. Whether or not one believes said person has a motive, did investigators have an actual factual case or not? At 10:30 p.m., Andrew reported his wife missing. And she would just call out of the blue., According to the Free Patricia Rorrer page on Facebook:I called him to let him know that I was going to the USA finals for a horse show. Stop. Shes where she belongs in prison for the rest of her life. The "Wrong Man" team explores whether Vonda may have been wrongfully convicted. Other loyal friends and associates attested to Patricias kindness toward horses and devotion to her daughter, whom she took along as she worked in stables. State: Oklahoma. in tandem with no evidence of home invasion. Which Patricia did not, so who is the real killer? She was always looking for a fight, Gary Gabard told the Morning Call, which noted that he was a head shorter than Patricia. Susan Wright is out of prison after killing her husband in TX. A person tried in a court of law and then found guilty is not the be-all and end-all to the case. Am I supposed to believe that she was still so enraged a week later, that she drove almost 10 hours, in a conspicuous van with a bad U-joint, to kill this woman and her baby? After one bullet didnt kill Joann, the gun locked up, so Patricia had to beat her to death, according to the prosecution. The obvious, if moot, response to this is to observe that her conviction wasnt based on inaccurate documentaries but on trial. Too bad she got off with just a life sentence. As for Joanns parents, her father died a year after the murder. He is the guilty one. Re Sells, the problem viz some serial killers is in exaggerating the number as a badge of honour. Animals would have for sure. Irelands husband buried it in the yard because he didnt feel comfortable with a firearm inside, she said. That said, Im curious to know how you arrived at that decision about her guilt. Its true that women were more idiots than about men, they had the impression that if they caught a fool to take them as wives, they would settle for life, even today we see that but more diluted, still an exaggerated reason for murder. Wow. . Patricia Lynne Rorrer made for a good suspect. Patricia seemed like the girl next door but all of a sudden, something snapped, Katrinak later told Wrong Man investigators. For one thing, her mother never asked Sandra Ireland to hide the gun, and she retrieved it on the way home the next day she worked as a bus driver and couldnt take it with her to school. So whats your point (other than many people are stupid and you arent)? Pat had a string of bad relationships in her past and was not happy. And Patricia wasnt all edges. And for you to even ask why documentaries are biased, makes me wonder if you have the ability to determine fact from fiction! If her husband was going to do that Im sure he wouldve done it in a totally different way! I agree. Theyre more than happy to exaggerate and speculate the details of the crime, which serves to attract more viewers who (like you) seem to be happy to believe it all. And this doesnt apply to your opinion learnt from a well-researched book, from documentaries which show and mention a great deal of facts and evidence which was never brought up at her trial. They dont need to make money??? The hair evidence is not compelling because theres a very good possibility that the evidence was compromised. It all gave jurors a lot to think about but only for six hours. Andrew described his existence with Joanne and Alex as a little Camelot., Ex-spouse off list. Had there been a switch? Or the ME and the entomologist that explained how impossible it would be for that baby and mother to be out there for four months, deceased at that, and still be as intact as they were, and the fact that the baby was double the size of a three month old child. (even though hes married and has a baby) Who does that?!! Under supervision of a doctor, 39 hair specimens were removed, recorded and logged. The media love the femme fatale., FBI lab blunder. They tested the hair last night on Reasonable Doubt using updated technology it is definitely Patricias. She would also have no heart when it comes to children, not even her own. How about the two eyewitnesses that identified her alive days after her disappearance. The victims vanished on December 15. How would an intruder find it? She failed miserably to convince me, or anyone else who mattered, of her innocence.. For this week, I looked into the defenders reasoning as well as Patricias whereabouts today. Testimony from Walter Blalock contradicted Patricias claim that she never had a gun. Well of course it is, so you overstated your opinion as though you know it to be fact, thus the jury and others were wrong; ironic because youre quick to complain that others are much to sure of *their* opinion shes guilty. New state, new man. And yikes, he discovered someone had cut one of the houses phone lines and pried the hinge on the basement door. A few fries short of a Happy Meal, that one. Im quite happy to accept that ANYONE who makes a TV documentary makes it for money. Traupman died in 2016. DNA also doesnt lie. The difference between the cases was that the child was not injured and the individual wrote down the details of the plan in a notebook, but otherwise it seems extremely similar to me. I believe the answer to your question is in my comment above. They theorize that Andrew Katrinak framed Patricia and that the hostile phone call between Patricia and Joann actually took place not on Dec. 12 as Andrew said but rather on Dec. 7. A man normally wouldnt care about killing a child, but a woman normally would have some kind of abhorrence to harming an innocent child. Rather, Im conservative when it comes to potential disagreement with the jury: I wasnt there to see/hear evidence and to declare theyre wrong! DNA tests proved the blonde hairs were hers. It says that Andrew Katrinak passed his lie detector test. Walmart woe. An infant was lying face down on her stomach. Patricia and her husband broke up after the babys death. Now retired, he declined ForensicFilesNow.coms invitation to spar directly with Patricia via a podcast. She only spoke on the phone with him a couple of times a year; when she called that last time, she didnt even know if Andys child was a boy or a girl, and the baby was almost 4 months old.
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